The future of T&T's RoF server

[Hellbender]

I'd like to discuss a sensitive topic here, so feel free to moderate this thread any way you see fit.

I've heard quite a few rumours on the T&T RoF and Teamspeak server that things are not going all too well, both from a technical as from a financial point of view. I've also seen with my own eyes how the server suffers tremendously under heavy load from this sim.

Before going any further, let's set a few things straight first



1) The Tactics & Teamwork server is, bar none, the Rise of Flight multiplayer hub on the internet. It's an honour you were probably never actively seeking, but it is upon you whether you like it or not. The reason for that is quite simple: regardless of current stability issues, your server is still the most stable, has the best maps and boasts a friendly and respectful global community, thanks to its central location (UK, if I'm not mistaken).

2) While this community is loyal and plentiful, few flyers seem to wear the T+T tag. Maybe some are hidden members (or secret supporters) who choose not to wear the tag, but I'm willing to go out on a limp here and say most people are here simply because it's a great, free server. I know I am.

2) Server hardware and bandwidth cost money. Capitalism says hi.



So here's my question to the people at Tactics & Teamwork: are the rumours true? Is RoF eating much more bandwidth than expected and putting too much strain on the hardware? Are you considering to shut down the whole thing?

Before the RoF server simply disappears one day without warning, let us know how we should chip in. Tell us how much running RoF is costing you every month and give us a realistic number of how much you'd expect regular flyers to pay.

I hope the server can stay around in its present form at least until NeoQB fixes the netcode and server-side issues of the sim.



S! :salute:

- Hb

[HybridX]

Hi Hellbender and thanks for the kind words.

Alot of the T&T flyboys are engaged in real life at the moment through work, personal issues or just the run up to Christmas meaning a heavy T&T presence isnt there at the moment.
For some of us its a hardware issues and we're waiting/planning to upgrade. This being the case for me personally. While im not a Flyboy by any degree I do like the look of RoF and once i have my new rig up in 2-3 weeks time ill be sure to make a presence.

Regarding the RoF server future thats one for epoch, I too have heard the odd word about the upkeep of the RoF server wheather it be funds wise or not.

Saying this with a cheeky smile, donations are always welcome to maintain the website, teamspeak and game servers. (Visit the paypal link on the mainpage)

Anyway evitably this is a thread for epoch to answer

Hyb signing out.

[Sadist_Cain]

indeed this is an epoch thread...

If I may give a glimmer into the T&T life as I've known it.

The community started loooong ago as MKP on the game Raven shield and had a few mad members (not fit for the likes of "normal" society) :p

The aim was about fun, yet organised multiplayer gaming, a good social occaision and a way to meet some rather interesting folks.

Then came Project Reality and the T&T name change, things were slow at first but then all of a sudden T&T became THE place for Euro PR gamers one 32 player server (hardly ever full) became two 64 player servers and one 32 player, two of which were full most of the time.

Needless to say the community almost grow too quick for the memberbase to support (or afford)
However it seems to have plateaued and reach a self sufficient point in recent months, though not as busy as wed like due to the real life things that hybrid mentioned.

Now the RoF server's popularity has taken a lot of folks by surprise and we have the same situation whereby there's Hardware costs and other things to consider (principly that the majority of the website and members are more geared towards PR and there are a few folks who arent flyers)

We've reached a point where we need to think about where the community is going to head towards and do we have the manpower to support any possible changes.

In short, Do we take another leap of faith into becoming more of a multi game community? expanding our memberbase to folks from all different walks of game and if we do, how are we going to make adjustments to the server box('s?) and the website to help cater more to the masses than just the few?

I'm pretty sure our diety Mr. Epoch has already been pondering this one and will be getting back to you with a reply that makes more sense :)

[HybridX]

Cain with the long winded response as usual ;) love ya really!

The T&T community delves into a wide variety of games to cover most peoples preferences.

To be honest alot of the presence issues can be tied down to just the wrong time of year. It happens every year in 2-3 spots where T&T presence fluctuates like clockwork. After Christmas itll pick up again on the servers and all will continue.

[epoch]

I will reply to this thread later.

In the meantime, thanks for your kind words Hellbender.

Don't worry - the server's not in imminent threat!

[Miggins]

I know our Hussars servers cost a bit to run, and it's not nearly as beefy as the T&T ones either.

In the current financial climate not all the Hussars are able to contribute as much as in the past either.

I spend more of my time in your server than our own too, and the rest of the Hussars are not to taken with RoF in it's current form, hence us running the server with every possible pilot aid turned on.

If you guys do have to pull the plug it'll be a sad day for sure. Ill see how my finances stand after working out how much this new PC has put me into the red and maybe visit your paypal donate button.

[Sadist_Cain]

My ultimate plan is global domination via the internet so I hope one day for a global gaming community population tantamount to a small country...

Perhaps that's just me... :D

[imp]

World domination is always a good goal :D

I'd like to request that hellbender stops beeing such a sneaky bastard. Also the N28 is utterly uber and should be removed from all maps!















( j/k :P)

[Sensenmann]

Also the N28 is utterly uber and should be removed from all maps!

Right then! Off to the mission editor to replace all the entente planes with n17s in all my missions!!! :D

[epoch]

Just a brief update to this thread.

For info, the T&T RoF server runs on a seperate dedicated server to our other "FPS" games (ArmA2, Project Reality etc). However, our other box does run the Teamspeak server, which caters for all our activities.

As so few of the T&T membership play Rise of Flight, it's not fair that they contribute to that server. So, the RoF server is paid for largely by the contributions from Masaq and Madtommy, and the remainder by myself (which varies depending on whether there are any RoF specific donations in any month). Take into account that I very rarely play RoF, but that the server's popularity took us all by surprise, so I kinda feel obliged to continue supporting it.

Historically, T&T is an FPS community. However, it so happens that a few of us enjoy flight sims, and play Blackshark, Lockon, and Rise of Flight. Of those, only RoF has a dedi server. We certainly don't have a history in the sim field (e.g. IL-2).

We've had a few applications from RoF players to join T&T, which have come to nothing. That's unfortunate, but at the same time I'm kinda relieved, because I worry that as we are not an 'established' sim community, we have little to offer RoF-only members.

It would be great to diversify our membership, and have sim players join us, but there's nobody really in T&T at the moment who can 'take the lead' on that.

For the time being then, I guess we need to rely on donations from RoF players - as and when they are made.

For reference. the RoF server running cost is around £90 ($148 / €99) per month.

We are grateful for any contributions towards this.

The RoF server should be ok for the time being. However, in the longer term I can't be 100% sure, as naturally our FPS server is the priority, as it has the largest user-base.

Also, I notice our Teamspeak server is regularly used by many RoF players, but I don't see them on the T&T server. As a general rule, the T&T Teamspeak server is open for people playing on T&T-provided servers. Joining the TS server and playing elsewhere is .. well ... it's taking liberties isn't it?

If people wish to make use of Teamspeak and play elsewhere, then small regular contributions would seem fair. Alternatively, I'm happy to create a private server for a reasonable monthly fee.

Hopefully this clears up some of the issues surrounding Rise of Flight. Please feel free to PM me with any questions etc.

[Hellbender]

Thanks for the heads-up, epoch!

And once again, thank you for running this awesome server. Hope you guys will indeed stick around a little longer.


I also agree about people using T&T Teamspeak and then playing on another server is inadmissible (well, except when the T&T server is down).

Also hope you are getting a few financial contributions your way from regular flyers.


For reference. the RoF server running cost is around £90 ($148 / €99) per month.

:eek:

That's a lot more than I expected.

[imp]

Really appreciate your server epoch. Beeing a poor student I hope my symbolic donation is of any help :)

[HybridX]

part of your student loan would be more helpfull lol

Just kidding ;)

[imp]

We don't have that here :p

[HybridX]

rob a convenience store then :D its all gravy!

[Cheesygoodness]

Lemme give a little words to the people that truly enjoy the ROF server.

First off. I am not a simmer nor am I a flyer. Nor am I a member of T&T or really affiliated with them other then ensuring they are no indeed attempting to end the American Revolution.

What I can speak for is being involved with communities of this nature. I can only speak from personal experiences and those are not with this community.

Most people that play on an online game for PC are doing so on a dedicated server paid for by people whom are there to enjoy that server. The best way to ensure that the server you love is and will always be there is to give what you can when you can.

I've been a member of a community like this for many years. Regardless of what is said I always had the same view of 'types' of players. I viewed everyone I played with regularly as friends. Of those there were those that cared for the server. And those that cared for the game.

There are those players that simply enjoy the server itself and the fun it was part of but when they left the server they never had a second thought. Then there were those that came to the forums, that donated when needed or regularly.

Admittedly for T&T I've been more of the first then the second. I'll throw 20-40 bucks every few months to pay for what I think is my teamspeak use and if I were to regularly play one of the games I'd throw more for that server.

Unfortunately I don't find myself regularly playing on any of there servers. I'm on a PR hiatus. I don't play ROF. So I generally don't give as much money as I should. However I've spoken with Epoch and others that keep this community floating. I've made my opinions clear. If they ever need money for a month then a simple word to get my ass in gear is all that is needed. I owe nothing to T&T. I owe nothing to the servers. What I do owe even though I am not a major part of T&T is the good-times and friendships I've made here.

So before I got even more of a rant on here is my point to you. If you want something to stay no matter what regardless of situations? Give what you feel you should and can. Don't wait for word. Don't wait till the server is gonna go down. Support what you think you should support.

[Hellbender]

Guys, if I may give one last word of advice.

Next to the regulars' donations, consider to ask for some sponsoring.


No, not by annoying punch-the-clown-to-win-an-iPod-and-lifetime-Viagra-supply ads.

Let NeoQB sponsor you.



Honestly, I believe many of your Tactics and Teamwork members (especially those who are not playing Rise of Flight) don't realise just how popular your server is with the American, European and Australian community of the sim.

And I'm sure you understand how important our Dollars, Pounds and Euros are to NeoQB's success.

Even devs play on your server regularly, instead of playing solely on Russian-based ones.


No, I'm not here to promote some kind of extortion, but I would recommend you explain the situation to them, especially the part about your uncertain future and ask them for a sensible donation, simply to cover part of the costs.

You're not asking for much here, a couple of tenners a month to guarantee the survival of the most popular Western server.



Then again, I've already had quite a few run-ins with them regarding their business model, especially their obstinate refusal to publish the game on Steam or to release more free planes to attract hesitant simmers, so be careful bringing up money with them. In my humble experience in corporate banking, it's either an excellent sign or a truly frightening one when a company feels uncomfortable discussing its finances. I'm betting on the latter.

They seem to be quite foolhardy on wanting to cash in as much as possible on short term sales in their little shop instead of thinking on the long term.

Oh well, at least I'll be able to "told you so" them if they do go belly-up, which they, sadly, very likely will.



I sincerely hope I'm wrong about that last bit.

[imp]

That sure does not sound very nice. Then again, if they were trying to make as much money as possible they should have tried to push out more planes with the last patch which they did not. Or maybe something else! :D


Edit: I was just thinking, since the D.VIII is only one plane and all other planes came in pairs (right?) maybe it will be a free christmas present from neoqb ;) With that I shall beat you relentlessly over your N28 until you cry!


The D.VIII is probably the easiest WWI plastic model aircraft to build btw :D I might get one when I like it ingame despite the huge stack of Fw190s I still haven't touched.

Edit2: I was considering to start a new thread but then I didn't: here is my plastic model aircraft album: http://imp.roladder.net/albums

In case you are wondering why basically all of them are Luftwaffe: it makes research and buying paint alot easier :D

[Eddieboi]

Hi all, I dont actually play RoF im mainly a PR fanboy...PR is pretty much my main PC game to play and I do play other games like Empire Total War, Raven shield, sims 3 etc etc.

However Ive bene part of T&T since June I believe and Ive never looked back in joining, fab bunch of guys and loads of fun when playing PR or even Company of Heroes blitzkrieg (eh hybrid lol)

Because of this community and I dont say clan, I feel obliged but privelaged to play on the T&T PR server and to have my name in purple!

Ive been thinking about getting RoF as I do kinda want to get into flight sims...Ive got Lockon and Blackshark (which in all honesty is one hell of a steep learning curve) which in a way havnt appealed to me but I can see RoF doing so, I use to play a similiar game a while back like 1999 and i loved it so RoF should be even uber!

So ill be getting the game end of the month plus adding extra bit to my monthly contribution I pay to T&T aka Epoch :P

[Sadist_Cain]

Joystick is on the way (Saitek X52, Did I make good? :S)

Will get RoF closer to christmas (no point having it without the Joystick)

Will be helping out more with the RoF server costs also...

intrigued to see how popular we actually are on there and how many more of ye kind folk I can drag unto here...

Being appointed Chief Evangelist by Epoch I feel it is my duty to encourage all to gel into our world, Some of us are rather intrigued by yours up there in the clouds

It's worth noting that the Website has got a lot of (slightly hidden) "social networking" kinda features, friend groups this can help pilots keep track of other pilots or PR/L4D/CoH Deer Hunter players... :idiot:

feel free to drag other fellow simmers towards the webby, the important thing is making the community grow, not just expecting a select few poor souls to bear the weight of many others.

Green, Purple, red whatever dam colour you are, Use this website to commune with in game buddy's, post your screenies in the gallery, use the forums (fucking love the lunchbox :p) and drag more people unto here! this is the community, and we welcome ye,as a general rule the more webby traffic in relation to server use shows the helthiness of the community

therefore there's more people who need pay less money, that's my penultimate point.



You've just been on a crazy journey with me congratulations, we made it with an incredibly long post to an astonishingly short point. :salute:

Oh look a squirrel...

[Eddieboi]

X52 a good joystick I have the pro version not any different apart from it's black and slightly different design

[Freddy Chickenbatter]

I have the X52 also and I am very happy with it

[SqnLdr]

I use a CH Flightsick - it's beige and IBM compatable!
Now I think about it, I have a feeling it's older than I am.

[epoch]

Joystick ownage:

http://library.thinkquest.org/06aug/01856/media/AtariJoystick.jpg

[MadTommy]

and that's just to sit on to get some force feedback.

[Sadist_Cain]

That'd be good for MotoGP, Then you can lean to get around corners

[Eddieboi]

hahaha. I also have the saitek rudder pedals to lol

[imp]

If this is becomming the official rof chatting thread I shall proudly announce that I finally made ace and got a streak of 5 in multiplayer \o/

All of them camels, scored on an Albatros D.Va (4) and a Fokker Dr.I (1) :) And since I am sort of showing off already I might aswell add that I scored the first 4 Camels in one mission :D

[Sadist_Cain]

http://www.rcsimulations.com/spitfire.html

Well I've got this ner ner ner Eddie.... :p

I think we should call you Ace Imp now then dude :salute:

[Freddy Chickenbatter]

HAH !!! tis nothing compared to my state of the art flight simulator note the clever use of silly hat design and trumpets